Milo's 2nd Playdate - A BARK FEST

[sweetlychee]

Hi Guys,

Remember I told you that Milo had a problem with other dogs? This weeken was his second playdate with our aunt's two dogs - a tiny pug and a rottweiler/german shepherd mix. The outcome was crazy.



At here, Milo laid down. He looked so scared. The big dog nudges him to play but he doesn't. The pug sniffs him and Milo just plays dead.


The big dog is fierce and huge! That might have scared Milo but she was so nice. I realized she just wanted to play. They were all chasing him but Milo was not cooperating.


I think 20 minutes passed by and then Milo became very angry. He then chased and barked at them for almost 2 hours. We stayed for another hour afterwards to have some tea and let the dogs drink and eat. Milo was so fierce. The big dog (Lucky) is like 4x times his size. I have never seen Milo show his teeth like that. He also ran to me to either seek protection or to protect me. I even played with Lucky and Cookie (the pug). At one point, Milo almost injured Lucky's nose!!!!!! We stayed for a total of 4 hours and 3.5 hours was Milo barking at them. Lucky was barking vociferously too!

Our aunt was so nice and suggested to come back for the third time. It'll get better she said. I have never seen Milo like this. I know he has a problem. Oh, where is Caesar Millan when you need him?!

What's up with my little corgi to even want to take down a german shepherd/rottweiler?! That dog is HUGE! But so gentle! She's taller than me!

What do you think guys?

[sweetlychee]

This is the way I see Milo. He was looking up at us when we all humans left them down at the yard. He was all alone with the dogs and he hid under the porch.

By the way, we took him home to wash of all the drool and slobber that Lucky barked at him. Since she towered over him, all the drool rained down on him! Hahaha.

[corgimom]

Originally Posted by sweetlychee

Hi Guys,

Remember I told you that Milo had a problem with other dogs? This weeken was his second playdate with our aunt's two dogs - a tiny pug and a rottweiler/german shepherd mix. The outcome was crazy.



At here, Milo laid down. He looked so scared. The big dog nudges him to play but he doesn't. The pug sniffs him and Milo just plays dead.


The big dog is fierce and huge! That might have scared Milo but she was so nice. I realized she just wanted to play. They were all chasing him but Milo was not cooperating.


I think 20 minutes passed by and then Milo became very angry. He then chased and barked at them for almost 2 hours. We stayed for another hour afterwards to have some tea and let the dogs drink and eat. Milo was so fierce. The big dog (Lucky) is like 4x times his size. I have never seen Milo show his teeth like that. He also ran to me to either seek protection or to protect me. I even played with Lucky and Cookie (the pug). At one point, Milo almost injured Lucky's nose!!!!!! We stayed for a total of 4 hours and 3.5 hours was Milo barking at them. Lucky was barking vociferously too!

Our aunt was so nice and suggested to come back for the third time. It'll get better she said. I have never seen Milo like this. I know he has a problem. Oh, where is Caesar Millan when you need him?!

What's up with my little corgi to even want to take down a german shepherd/rottweiler?! That dog is HUGE! But so gentle! She's taller than me!

What do you think guys?

Sweetlychee,

Honestly, I would not take Milo there again for now. It does not sound like he was having fun(hiding under the deck for one thing and showing his teeth) -this is just my opinion, but it is not something I would do and no, it may not get better. I think putting him in with both dogs is not something I would have done first. I would have taken a walk, along with the other owner, your relative, and her pug where they could have interacted a bit while being on a leash, and then when you got back, I would have just had those two dogs interact on their own to see how it went, without the big dog in the mix.

Honestly, if Milo were taken to Cody's day care that he goes to - they would have done a two hour evaluation on him prior to him being allowed to participate - if he would have done what you described, he would not be able to participate in a Dog Daycare.

It does not sound like Milo likes the big dog for whatever reason, but this is not a play group that I would pursue further; unless something can change. Not sure what else to tell you regarding helping Milo's socialization skills with other dogs; hopefully someone here with more experience can direct you.

[sweetlychee]

I agree he probably didn't enjoy it. My aunt is more experienced in the dog socialization thing. Milo is anti-dog. I clearly see that. I kind of doubt he'll get better but my aunt insist he'll get better. Milo likes to be a loner?

When he was young, there were so many unfriendly dogs in the neighborhood. That might shook up his nerves a bit and made him like this. Milo would never bite us and harm us. He didn't bite any dog but always growl or bark ferociously.

If he doesn't ever want to associate with another dog, then I guess that's ok. He would pull and tug if there's a dog nearby on a leash so we scrapped that idea. And of course, Milo in doggy daycare? Hah! I have a better chance of winning the lotto.

[corgimom]

Sweetly Chee, how does Milo do around small children; lets say toddlers?

The comment about the day care was just an example of what a professional dog care would do before interacting dogs together. Obviously at your aunts you just put them together, but when Milo hid under the deck, that was a good indicator that it was not something he
wanted to participate in.

[Dillydoodle]

deleted my post

[sweetlychee]

Originally Posted by Dillydoodle

The first thing i see in the first photo appears that Milo is showing submission and the Large dog is showing dominance - look at the tail- it is up, which is a way of a dog showing dominance. Also I think that Milo needs to find another play date with maybe a completely unrelated dog ( not any of the dogs he has already played with) amd maybe a dog that is a comparable size. I think getting him socialized is really important. I think the fact that he had unfriendly dogs in his neighborhood and had such poor experiences during his younger developmental stage may also be what makes him anti-dog now. I think he needs to have a really positive experience. I would probably talk to a licensed dog trainer to see if they have suggestions or maybe even a submissive dog that could help Milo through this. It is really important that you work on this with him and not give up, not that him getting on with other dogs is so very important but he may look at a toddler in the same way he looks at other dogs...and that could spell disaster in the long run if you plan to have children. By the way, I just think he is adorable looking, and love that loving look as he looks up at you, just way too cute!

Emilie

Thank you, Emilie for the kind words.

Linda: Milo is very good with kids and wants them to play with him. He even met some kids in the street where the little girl wanted to take him home! He let kids pet him and touchh his fur. He's very good with humans, period. Dogs on the other hand...nah.

I do want to get him socialize and he did not have positive experiences when he was young. He's even good with strangers! Sometimes I want him to be more wary with strangers..but not with dogs.

In the beginning, I can tell Lucky was more dominating. But, afterwards, Milo was very vocal and loud. He chased them and scared Lucky away! I don't know who else has a dog so we can do a playdate with them. I'm afraid they will find my Milo disturbing and weird.

[glencorgi]

Originally Posted by sweetlychee

I agree he probably didn't enjoy it.

Looking at the pictures and the body language of the dogs, I'd say you were very lucky that the playdate didn't end up with a trip to the vet's. The GSDXRottie mix is not inviting him to play, that is an attack mode look in her eye. What Milo is doing right in that instance is not looking at her and diverting his gaze to the side. He's not issuing a challenge to her.

My aunt is more experienced in the dog socialization thing.
Milo is anti-dog. I clearly see that. I kind of doubt he'll get better but my aunt insist he'll get better. Milo likes to be a loner?

With all due respect to your aunt, that she allowed the situation to go as it did only put Milo in harm's way. It won't get better and he'll remember this "playdate." Next time he goes in, he'll be loaded for bear as in the last photo, hackles up, teeth bared and now issuing the challange to fight and the mix will be more than happy to oblige him. There is NOTHING in her body language, movements or demeanor that is inviting him to play in any of the photos.

Milo is not necessarily anti-dog, he just maybe doesn't like big dogs and with experiences like this one, who could blame him? He and the Pug seem much more compatible. Why does he need playdates? Corgis are not pack animals in the same sense as hounds are - like Beagles or Foxhounds for example. His pack is the humans he lives with and that's all he needs.

When he was young, there were so many unfriendly dogs in the neighborhood. That might shook up his nerves a bit and made him like this. Milo would never bite us and harm us. He didn't bite any dog but always growl or bark ferociously.

This playdate only reinforced his fears and issues that developed when he was young. Also what goes down the leash is a big influencing factor on how he reacts.

If he doesn't ever want to associate with another dog, then I guess that's ok. He would pull and tug if there's a dog nearby on a leash so we scrapped that idea. And of course, Milo in doggy daycare? Hah! I have a better chance of winning the lotto.

Unless there are more photos of negative interactions with the Pug, I wouldn't say that he was anti-dog or couldn't have a positive experience in playing with other dogs - his size. It would definitely take desensitization, training and work, but it could happen.

As for him trying to take down the big dog - they were bred to move cattle, what's a dog of that size in that context? Does it surprise me? NO. My Obie tried to take off after a Mastiff once, still haven't figured out if he didn't like the dog or he thought it was a cow.

Debbie

[sweetlychee]

Oh Debbie. Thanks for the advice. I was really scared something bad could happened too. Though the big dog is fierce looking, she was very welcoming and nice to all of us. She let me pet her and she's very nice to the pug. I didn't want anyone to be hurt. And if Milo doesn't change, then it's ok with me. I don't mind as long as no one is hurt.

I try to do what's best but since Milo is our first dog, it's hard. That's why I come here for advice. In the end, Milo went home and slept. When he woke up, he wanted to eat my dinner! =) I will try to read up on information related to this.

Milo cannot take down the rottweiler/gsd mix. I can tell. Even I can't take her down.

[glencorgi]

Originally Posted by sweetlychee

Milo cannot take down the rottweiler/gsd mix. I can tell. Even I can't take her down.

The Pug is part of her pack and something she protects. Milo was an intruder in her territory. Being people friendly and welcoming doesn't always extend to other animals.

And don't be so sure he couldn't take her down. I know of a Cardigan that took out a GSD at a show. Went for the throat and hit the jugular.

Debbie

[sweetlychee]

I know pics are harder to tell. But I honestly believe the big dog was trying to play and have fun. This is their second meeting. Everytime they met, the big dog has been friendly and nudges Milo when he's playing dead. Milo doesn't care what size you are - pug or GSD/Rott mix. He barked and went after the pug also.

This reminds me of how all the time my fiance said we should have gotten Milo and his brother at the same time. But I wasn't prepared to handle TWO dogs. Sure, they would have socialized but two dogs?! I'm a first time owner. I'm sick of hearing them say we should have gotten his brother. Look, we didn't. Get over it. let's deal with our ONE dog. Fate has it. No turning back. We can now move on and do the best we can. It's not like we don't feed him!

Sorry, I needed to vent.

[sweetlychee]

By the way, we thought of getting another dog in the future also. So we do WANT him to be friendly with dogs but is it not in his nature to like other dogs? Yes, corgis are not a pack dog. But, he shouldn't really be a loner...but whatever is best for him, I will do. I want to give him the best life he deserves.

[corgimom]

Originally Posted by glencorgi

The Pug is part of her pack and something she protects. Milo was an intruder in her territory. Being people friendly and welcoming doesn't always extend to other animals.

And don't be so sure he couldn't take her down. I know of a Cardigan that took out a GSD at a show. Went for the throat and hit the jugular.

Debbie

Hmmm...that sounds like my nieghbors dog right down the street from us when she intereacts with Cody - she always gets him on his back and goes for the jugular each and every time - not a dog I want him to be around

[Dillydoodle]

deleted post

[glencorgi]

Originally Posted by sweetlychee

This reminds me of how all the time my fiance said we should have gotten Milo and his brother at the same time. But I wasn't prepared to handle TWO dogs. Sure, they would have socialized but two dogs?! I'm a first time owner. I'm sick of hearing them say we should have gotten his brother. Look, we didn't. Get over it. let's deal with our ONE dog. Fate has it. No turning back. We can now move on and do the best we can. It's not like we don't feed him!

Well you can tell the fiance that you made the correct decision in not getting Milo's littermate. It is strongly advised against getting two puppies from the same litter. They already have a bond between them and often times that stays stronger than any bond or relationship they develop with their owners. Reputable, responsible breeders rarely will consider placing two littermates together.

Before you add a second dog or even think about having children of your own in the future (a baby in "his" home may not be as welcomed as children on the street), you might want to find a copy of [U=]Child-Proofing Your Dog[/u] by Brian Kilcommons and Sarah Wilson just for future reference. You also need to work on Milo's issues. Maybe some in home training for you if classes aren't readily available or accessible.

Debbie