What is premium dog food

This is a discussion on What is premium dog food within the Diet & Nutrition forums, part of the Health & Wellness category; Today a new member asked what he/she sould feed her forthcoming Corgi pup. That led me on to pinpoint just ...

  1. #1
    Global Moderator
    Join Date Oct 2005
    Location Silverstream (near Wellington, the capital of NZ)
    Posts 8,582
    Dog(s): Taylor

    What is premium dog food

    Today a new member asked what he/she sould feed her forthcoming Corgi pup.
    That led me on to pinpoint just what is premium dog food because that is what most of us would advise this person to feed his/her Corgi throughout the life of the dog.

    Premium dog food is:
    *made with nutritious ingredients
    *containing few fillers or by-products
    *providing all the nutritional, mineral and vitamin ingredients required for the life stages of a dog
    * generally consistent
    *generally high quality ingredients
    *balanced and consistent from bag to bag.

    The author of the above is a celebrated American vet who says that his favourite premium food he provides for his own dogs include: Hills Science, Iams, Eukanuba and Waltham products ( Royal Canin, Nutro, Cesar and others I take it)).
    Last edited by Michael Romanos; 08-07-2008 at 10:04 PM.
  2. #2
    Senior Member
    Join Date Jan 2007
    Location Utah
    Posts 5,501

    Premium dog food is:
    *made with nutritious ingredients
    I agree there.

    *containing few fillers or by-products
    Corn, wheat, rice, oatmeal, bran are all fillers. The higher they are on the ingredient list the less likely it's a good food.

    The author of the above is a celebrated vet who says that his favourite premium food he provides for his own dogs include: Hills Science, Iams, Eukanuba and Watham products
    (Royal Canin, Nutro, Cesar etc).
    Here's where I disagree. Preimum foods are NOT found in grocery stores. Iams and Waltham products (Pedigree) are found in grocery stores. Cesar is found in grocery stores. ProPlan is found in grocery stores here. Purina ONE is found in grocery stores. Now some of these foods are better than others but they are not IMO, preimum foods. Some of them are good foods and some are not so good.

    Eukanuba and Science Diet while not in grocery stores are not IMO, preimum foods. They have too many fillers (meaning in this case corn) in them.

    Innova, California Natural, Eagle Pak, Wysong, Flint River Ranch, Blue Buffalo, VF Complete, Canine Caviar, Dick Van Patten, Excel, Timberwolf Organics, Solid Gold, Hund-N-Flocken, Royal Canin are all among the preimum foods.

    Each of you needs to do your own reasearch and find the food you are comfortable feeding. Here's some sites that will help.
    Menu
    Dog Food Comparison
    Dog Feeding Info
    Dog Food -- Whole Dog Journal

    Peggy
    --
    Jim & Peggy Newman
    mailto: taflarpwc@yahoo.com
  3. #3
    Global Moderator
    Join Date Oct 2005
    Location Silverstream (near Wellington, the capital of NZ)
    Posts 8,582
    Dog(s): Taylor
    Peggy - I think you are being ridiculous again. I thought we had established that premium dog food can be purchased from grocery stores/supermarkets in the USA and probably most elsewhere. In New Zealand the more expensive premium food can only be purchased from pet shops and vet clinics.
    The author of the piece I wrote is an American who is not concerned I am sure where one can purchase the premium food he has mentioned.
    This thread was based on what constitutes premium food not a rundown on the full range of them.
  4. #4
    MyPemCharlie's Avatar
    Global Moderator
    Join Date Sep 2007
    Location Texas
    Posts 1,917
    I thought we had established that premium dog food can be purchased from grocery stores/supermarkets in the USA and probably most elsewhere.
    You meant " ...cannot be purchased from grocery stores/supermarkets...", didn't you?

    It looks like PetCo is now attempting to pick up super premium foods (like the recent addition of the Wellness line), but even PetCo and PetSmart have mostly carried slightly above "grocery store" quality food brands in the past.
    Chris & Charlie

    He Ain't Heavy, He's My Corgi!
  5. #5
    Senior Member
    Join Date Feb 2006
    Location Piedmont Triad, NC
    Posts 4,420
    The author of the piece I wrote is an American who is not concerned I am sure where one can purchase the premium food he has mentioned.
    I'm a bit confused. IF you wrote the piece, then aren't you the author? Or do you mean the source you quoted?

    This thread was based on what constitutes premium food not a rundown on the full range of them.
    A problem lies in just whom is defining what is premium food? The dog food company? A consumer buying in to a marketing program from the dog food manufacturer's advertising campaign? A discerning consumer who has researched extensively? There will be different answers from each. Is it a matter of ingredients? Or the order in which they appear on the label?

    Links to the best places to start researching foods have been posted many time and as was said each of you needs to do your own research and find the food you are comfortable feeding. Here's some sites that will help.
    Menu
    Dog Food Comparison
    Dog Feeding Info
    Dog Food -- Whole Dog Journal

    Any comments on this brand? Natural Range Of Premium Pet-food Products - Ziwipeak - Natural New Zealand Pet Nutrition
    "Products meet to stringent NZFSA and AAFCO approved standards.[B16]"
    It is even imported into the US. <IMO> that is a premium food.

    marion-nestle-futureofpetfood
    "Everything is premium or super-premium. Large and small companies alike marketed products as premium, although they could not define what that meant. Someóbut by no means allópremium products advertised a higher meat content with no by-products. Big Pet Food companies were introducing beautifully packaged premium products, but we thought their ingredient lists looked much the same as those of the nonpremium lines. Our distinct impression: Premium simply means higher price.

    Our Conclusion: Current trends in the pet food business reflect trends in the human food business. As evidence, we shipped home four boxes of brochures and samples. We will refer to these materials as we discuss some of the trends in more detail in forthcoming issues of Bark.

    © 2008 Bark Magazine

    Marion Nestle, PhD, MPH, is the Paulette Goddard professor of nutrition, food studies and public health at NYU; her latest book is What to Eat and her next, Pet Food Politics: The Chihuahua in the Coal Mine, comes out in September. Malden Nesheim, PhD, is professor and provost emeritus of Cornell University."

    We've seen time and time again in food discussions what one individual considers "premium" food, others of us don't consider it anywhere close in spite of the way it is packaged and marketed. Learning to read labels is very important and key to figuring out for one's self what is premium and what might not be.
    Interpreting Dog Food Labels
    Pet Food Labels - General
    How to Read Pet Food Labels
    Natural Health Corner: Learning to Read Dog Food Labels -- Canine University
    "In the ideal world the first four ingredients in food meant for canine consumption would be meat, with a small amount of grain and vegetables to give the food texture. This isnít possible in the commercial dog food industry because having a higher volume of meat tends to gum up the machinery and slow down production. This means less profits and more production time.

    On the whole, it is best to steer clear of foods that use meat by-products. If you must feed a food with by-products, at least choose one that lists the specific source. For instance, chicken by-product is not a great protein source but itís better quality than meat by-product. Meat by-product is a mix of beaks, feet, feathers, hooves, hair, tumors, and other low quality products made into a meat mix.

    There is no one dog food out there that is perfect for every dog. The higher quality foods tend to be hard to find and quite expensive, but the money you will save in veterinary bills is more than worth it. Consider doing some research on-line or at the bookstore to see for yourself what dog food is all about. Don't be surprised if the food that you thought was so good for your dog doesn't pass muster. That doesnítí mean that you need to go out tomorrow and change it, but it does make you a more informed consumer and a better dog owner. We all want what is best for our best pals and no one can say definitively that any one food will do it."

    Debbie
  6. #6
    Senior Member
    Join Date Jan 2007
    Location Utah
    Posts 5,501
    Peggy - I think you are being ridiculous again. I thought we had established that premium dog food can be purchased from grocery stores/supermarkets in the USA and probably most elsewhere.
    No, we did not establish that. You, as usual gave your ultimatum. What we did establish is that ProPlan can be found in some grocery stores in the US. And while I will agree that it is a better than average grocery store brand, I, personaly am not willing to say it's a preimum food.

    The author of the piece I wrote is an American who is not concerned I am sure where one can purchase the premium food he has mentioned.
    You know your quotes would hold much more water if you would give names and sources. Not just post whatever. How do we know who this is? What his credentials are? Just because this comes from an unnamed "celebrated American vet" doesn't mean anything. That doesn't tell us WHO or if he's even credible when it comes to dog food.

    Vets as we've pointed out numerous times DO NOT get a lot of training in nutrition. They are not, IMO and the opinion of many others on this forum, the only authorities on dog food or canine nutriton. Just because his/her opinion is what you mention are preimum foods does not necessarily make it so.

    This thread was based on what constitutes premium food not a rundown on the full range of them.
    And my post was on what I consider to be preimum foods. And I disagree with your definataion. You gave your opinion, I gave mine.

    Peggy
    Last edited by Peggy; 08-08-2008 at 03:25 PM.
    --
    Jim & Peggy Newman
    mailto: taflarpwc@yahoo.com
  7. #7
    Global Moderator
    Join Date Oct 2005
    Location Silverstream (near Wellington, the capital of NZ)
    Posts 8,582
    Dog(s): Taylor
    I think Nestle Purina will be very upset to learn that Peggy thinks that their international top of their range dog product, ProPlan is not considered premium dog food, let alone a couple of others in their range.
  8. #8
    LaRogue's Avatar
    Senior Member
    Join Date Jan 2008
    Location PA
    Posts 2,634
    I think Nestle Purina will be very upset to learn that Peggy thinks that their international top of their range dog product, ProPlan is not considered premium dog food, let alone a couple of others in their range.
    In the U.S. we are fortunate to have better dog foods than Purinia's international top of their range.
  9. #9
    MyPemCharlie's Avatar
    Global Moderator
    Join Date Sep 2007
    Location Texas
    Posts 1,917
    I think Nestle Purina will be very upset to learn that Peggy thinks that their international top of their range dog product, ProPlan is not considered premium dog food, let alone a couple of others in their range.
    Corporations don't have feelings, so Nestle Purina won't be upset at all that most of us on this forum believe there are much better foods manufactured than the Purina lines. Even Colgate-Palmolive Hill's Prescription Science Diet won't care that most of us think the same about its brands.
    Chris & Charlie

    He Ain't Heavy, He's My Corgi!
  10. #10
    Global Moderator
    Join Date Oct 2005
    Location Silverstream (near Wellington, the capital of NZ)
    Posts 8,582
    Dog(s): Taylor
    There may be better dog food than ProPlan. I think that there is. But I also accept along with many others, that Nestle Purina produce at least three products that are premium dog food and ProPlan is one of them.

    I would think that every (or almost every) canine or small animal nutritionist is also a vet. Some vets study nutrition for dogs (and cats) in ernest as to make them specialists in that regard. So it is nonsense for Peggy to palm off vets as having little or no knowledge of nutrition for dogs. In New Zealand all the vets here are compelled to study small animal nutrition and pass exams on the subject as part of their graduating as a vet. City vets in particular largely handle dogs and cats so that is where their emphasis on nutrition lies.
  11. #11
    Senior Member
    Join Date Jan 2007
    Location Utah
    Posts 5,501
    I didn't "palm off" all vets as having little or no knowlege. I said most. And I've said it more than once on this forum and other forums and lists. It's not nonsense, it's the truth.

    Yes, some vets will do studies after or in additon to vet school and those vets will have more knowledge. And I've yet to meet one who's done that who will endorse Science Diet.

    Vets in America get some courses on nutrition but not enough. And what they do get is sponsored or taught by the dog food companies. So of course they are going to slant it towards the food they make. The ones persue nutrition beyond vet school get a better and unbiased education in nutrition.

    In New Zealand all the vets here are compelled to study small animal nutrition and pass exams on the subject as part of their graduating as a vet.
    How much, how many quarters or semesters do they study nutrition. I'm betting they don't get any more than our vets in the US do.

    Peggy
    --
    Jim & Peggy Newman
    mailto: taflarpwc@yahoo.com
  12. #12
    Senior Member
    Join Date Feb 2006
    Location Piedmont Triad, NC
    Posts 4,420
    I would think that every (or almost every) canine or small animal nutritionist is also a vet.
    Maybe in New Zealand, but not necessarily in the US.

    Some vets study nutrition for dogs (and cats) in ernest as to make them specialists in that regard. So it is nonsense for Peggy to palm off vets as having little or no knowledge of nutrition for dogs.
    Again, that might be true in NZ but it is NOT standard course study for vets in the US. How about you not making blanket assumptions and stating them as fact about how things are in the US and we will reciprocate in regards to NZ.

    In New Zealand all the vets here are compelled to study small animal nutrition and pass exams on the subject as part of their graduating as a vet. City vets in particular largely handle dogs and cats so that is where their emphasis on nutrition lies.
    Again, not applicable to the US.

    Debbie
  13. #13
    Global Moderator
    Join Date Oct 2005
    Location Silverstream (near Wellington, the capital of NZ)
    Posts 8,582
    Dog(s): Taylor
    Debbie - What you call blanket assumptions is commonsense to me. A vet is more likely to concentrate their effiorts and do add-ons with time and extra study and consultation on the subject of dog and cat nutrition if not also caged bird (parrot) nutrition. Therefore there has got to be, even in the USA, vets with a great deal of knowledge on canine nuitrition without being declared a canine nutritionist. Recently the three American vets who had visited our Massey University took some time to take in lectures etc from the small animal/canine nutritionist chief at the university. They are part of the procession of vets from the USA and other parts of the world who visit here.
  14. #14
    Senior Member
    Join Date Feb 2006
    Location Piedmont Triad, NC
    Posts 4,420
    Debbie - What you call blanket assumptions is commonsense to me. A vet is more likely to concentrate their effiorts and do add-ons with time and extra study and consultation on the subject of dog and cat nutrition if not also caged bird (parrot) nutrition.
    A corgi Breeder friend graduated from the North Carolina State University School of Veterinary Medicine within the last ten years. I ran into her at a dog show back when she was still in school. The subject of food and what we were feeding came up. She stated she used to feed Brand X until she got to the nutrition class in vet school which was sponsored by Hills. She switched to Hills during that time because ..... drum roll please, are you ready? ... the company gave the vet students free food. That's the norm for general practitioner vets in the US.

    Recently the three American vets who had visited our Massey University took some time to take in lectures etc from the small animal/canine nutritionist chief at the university. They are part of the procession of vets from the USA and other parts of the world who visit here.
    And without admitting it or probably even realizing it, you've just proved the point Peggy and I both were making.

    Debbie
  15. #15
    LaRogue's Avatar
    Senior Member
    Join Date Jan 2008
    Location PA
    Posts 2,634
    There may be better dog food than Pro Plan. I think that there is. But I also accept along with many others, that Nestle Purina produce at least three products that are premium dog food and Pro Plan is one of them.
    I will explain to you why, I at least, don't consider Pro Plan to be a top of the range food. So I'm going to tell you a little story that might help you understand or at least have an idea of why some disagree with some of your positions.

    Mr. Pip is a lovable, beatutiful, happy little corgi. Everyone adores him, he has his very own fan club and I couldn't be happier with him. There is one fly in the ointment, however. Pip has allergies. In order of severity they are chicken, chicken fat, and wheat. Bear in mind, supposedly MOST dogs allergic to chicken are NOT also allergic to chicken fat or chicken eggs. Pip and I got the unlucky draw. About 3 years ago, when we narrowed down his allergies, everyone in their brother (breeders, owners of dogs with allergies, etc.) suggested Pro Plan Sensitive Skin and Stomach as THE way to go in feeding a dog with allergies. It's THE BEST THERE IS for allergies, everyone told me. Fine, what did I know? Not much, it turned out. I bought a bag and started feeding it to him. Miracle of miracles almost all of his symptoms were gone in less than a week!

    Almost, but not all. He was still going from having clear, normal eyes before meals to having red blood shot, runny eyes immediate after eating. A few hours after meal times, they went back to being clear and normal. Really strange, I thought. We went to the vet for eye checkups. Money was spent, nothing was medically wrong with his eyes. Hmmmmmm. I talked with vet, breeders, other owners, etc., and they all told me it takes time for the food to get into the system and for the symptoms to subside. Okay. I waited 6 months and no improvement. More money was spent on eye exams with nothing showing up. I finally decided to call Purina. I told the gentleman on the phone, I don't understand, there is no chicken in this food, why is my dog still having allergy symptoms after 6 months?!? He said "let me get the sheet to see what we are using right now" (HUH?) and puts me on hold. He came back and told me there IS chicken in the food and rattled off a list of all the animals that they were using for the animal fat. YUP, chicken was one of them. OMG!!!

    It's not a good feeling to find out you've been feeding your dog something that is making him sick. It makes you feel horrible, incompetent, and like a terrible pet owner who doesn't deserve to own a dog, actually.

    I got off the phone , determined to learn all I could and do my OWN food search, rather than rely on the opinion of others. That approach hadn't worked out so well for me. It was very daunting and confusing. I started with all the same sites that have been recommended here many, many times, to use for dog food research. I then moved onto looking at brands and found out, Hey, there are dog foods that list every single ingredient by name. For example, they listed chicken rather than poultry (which could be chicken, duck, turkey, etc) or animal fat (which can be anything). No guessing, no not knowing, they listed every single thing that goes into their food. That's good news for me and I started to feel like I might not be so hopeless. Then I found out there were dog food companies that test their fish, preserve their foods naturally, and don't add dyes or coloring. Sounded good to me and I filed the info in my noggin and moved onto to meat meal vs meat. I learned meal means more meat is in the food, due to the fluids being removed from the fresh meat during processing. Made sense to me! Next was a biggie-no hormones or antibiotics. With varying theories about what leads to allergies in the first place, this really got my attention. Some think immune system problems are genetic, some think it's junky food ingredients that include hormones and antibiotics, some thinks it's shots, and some think it's a combination of things leading to a compromised immune system, but no one knows for sure. If I could feed a food without hormones and antibiotics then I was determined to do that to give Pip's immune system the best chance possible. I've already been done the road with a corgi with auto immune disease and I wanted to make sure I do everything I can to help keep Pip's immune system as strong as possible.

    So I took all of this nice info I had dug up and compared it to my Pro Plan Sensitive Skin and Stomach bag. Was every single ingredient named? Nope. I had already found that one out the hard way. Did they boast their Salmon was tested for mercury or ethoxyn free? No. Was the fish meat the main ingredient? Not once it was processed. Was the salmon wild caught without hormones/antibiotics or was it farmed raised? No idea. Not a good report card, IMO. Especially now that I had learned there were other foods out there that all the answers to these questions were yes. Those are the foods I choose to feed my dog. Some cost less than the Pro Plan, some cost the same, and some cost more, but to me they are better choices.

    I would rather take the time and make the effort to learn about the different foods available than to feed Pip something that is harming him and could led to further health problems down the road by stressing out his immune system on a daily basis. So, maybe you will consider to at least look at some of the links and things that are provided to help people make their food selections. It can't hurt to look into what members are talking about, even if you come away with your opinion unchanged.
Page 1 of 6 123 ... Last
  • Jump to page:

Similar Threads

  1. Large Breed Food vs Regular Adult Food
    By Jhemphill in forum Diet & Nutrition
    Replies: 30
    Last Post: 08-25-2006, 12:39 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts

Tags for this Thread