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The dangers and value of meat for dogs

This is a discussion on The dangers and value of meat for dogs within the Diet & Nutrition forums, part of the Health & Wellness category; All meat and fish for dogs should be cooked and the cooking processes should be carefully managed. Providing raw meat ...

  1. #1
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    The dangers and value of meat for dogs

    All meat and fish for dogs should be cooked and the cooking processes should be carefully managed.
    Providing raw meat for dogs presents them with the dangers of: salmonella, campylobacter, escherichia coli, clostridium, perfringens, clostridium botulinum, staphylococcus aureus etc. Also dangerous pathogens are found in specific raw meats including beef, pork, wild game and fish.

    The best meat for dogs is tripe (boiled) which is rich in enzymes, has low fat content and has a good calcium-phosphorus ratio. Tripe is good against cancer, allergies, hyperactivity, flatulence, colitis etc.

    Organ meats (offal) follow next and should all be boiled - these include heart, liver, tongue and kidneys.

    Next comes horse, venison, goat, turkey and chicken with the latter pair to be avoided if your dog has a skin problem.

    Lamb and beef are not suitable for all dogs.

    Fish - fatty fish are best. These include mackerel, pilchard, tuna, salmon, eels, herrings as they contain vitamins A and D and are a good source of omega 3.
    Last edited by Michael Romanos; 12-17-2012 at 07:43 PM.
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    How strange. I posted a comment and it must have been deleted. Wierd...

    I will try again...the abridged version...
    I said that this thread is essentially the same thing as other threads started by same OP looking to pick a fight with other members.....again.

    Many people successfully feed their dogs raw. Their dogs are happy and healthy. Not everyone agrees with it, but there is more than one right way to care for a dog.

    Let's see if this post gets deleted as well....

    Emilie
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    I said that this thread is essentially the same thing as other threads started by same OP looking to pick a fight with other members.....again.
    Anything for an argument.....

    Peggy
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    How strange. I posted a comment and it must have been deleted. Wierd...
    And you're surprised???

    He's NOT a Dr. NOT a vet. NOT a nutritionist. NOT a breeder.

    "Just" a pet owner like most of us, except his mind is firmly closed to recent science (science in general, IMO) and he relies on regurigitating nutritional information supporting the products, his "interviewees" have a finacial interest in promoting.

    I don't think hardly anyone takes ANYTHING he posts, seriously. Those that might, usually seem to recognize what a mistake it is, in short order.

    Edited out what is not factual (MR).
    Last edited by Michael Romanos; 12-18-2012 at 04:14 PM.
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    Smile

    And you're surprised???

    He's NOT a Dr. NOT a vet. NOT a nutritionist. NOT a breeder.

    "Just" a pet owner like most of us, except his mind is firmly closed to recent science (science in general, IMO) and he relies on regurigitating nutritional information supporting the products, his "interviewees" have a finacial interest in promoting.

    I don't think hardly anyone takes ANYTHING he posts, seriously. Those that might, usually seem to recognize what a mistake it is, in short order.

    Unfortunately, new people that come on here that don't know any better see his post count and think that he must know what he is talking about.

    There are 4 or 5 subjects that he regurgitates over and over over in order to post whore and start arguments. I'm really beginning to tire of the whole thing myself.
    Last edited by Michael Romanos; 12-18-2012 at 04:15 PM.
    Sorry Michael Romanos is a moderator/admin and you are not allowed to ignore him or her.
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    Of course many dog owners take risks with their dogs from food poisoning in presenting their dogs with raw red and white meats and raw fish and these owners are often the first to criticise process dog food companies who have to have some batches of their products recalled because of contamination etc.

    Raw meat feeding presents a danger whilst proper and appropriate cooking of meat nullifies these dangers. The benefits of meat when cooked are reduced and to what extent depends on the cooking methods.

    Giving dogs raw chicken eggs also presents risks of salmonella and the whites of any raw egg can deplete a dog of biotin which is essential for a dog's growth, strength and coat health.
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    You would have to allow a dog to consume egg whites in large amounts over months to years to see a significant biotin depletion.
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    Where is your supporting evidence? How many cases of dogs receiving medical treatment from a food borne illness caused by a RAW diet vs how many dogs ate RAW and did NOT become ill? What is the difference is the numbers of dogs requiring medical treatment due to food related illness between dogs feed RAW and those feed commercial diets?

    BTW, don't leave out the numbers of dogs that were sickened in 2007 (?) from the melamin, the more recent chicken treats, from China, aflatoxin, etc. You want to argue point to some FACTS, rather than your opinion.
    Lord Stanley's Cup AND the Lombardi Trophy in the same year, it doesn't get any better than this! Whoo-Hoo!
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    Supporting evidence? Ha ha ha... Hope you won't waiting on him to supply that... You know it will never happen.

    Emilie
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    There is no need for me to go into a detailed account of dogs that suffer from minor to major from raw meat including fish and from raw chicken eggs because that has not been the claim. The claim is that dogs CAN suffer from consuming raw meat incl fish and from consuming raw chicken eggs and that is why a majority of vets would not recommend raw meat/fish and chicken eggs to be given to dogs. An exception maybe with certain types of beef bones because bones should always be given raw and the benefits of certain types of beef bones probably outweigh the risks so long as the bones are not given too regularly and are removed from the dog within hours of being presented. Add to this the proviso that the dog given the bone is not a allergy sufferer associated with beef or protein.
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    Dogs can also suffer from eating kibble and processed foods.

    I am personally much more concerned about the risk of long term effects of feeding kibble on a dog's lifespan, quality of life and overall health.

    Home made diets (raw or cooked) were the subject of a study that compared home made diets to commercial ones. Dogs fed a home made diet were found to live on average 2-3 years longer than ones fed commercially prepared diets.

    A synopsis of the study can be found here: http://www.ukrmb.co.uk/images/LippertSapySummary.pdf
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    Interesting study Gally!

    There is no need for me to go into a detailed account of dogs that suffer from minor to major from raw meat including fish and from raw chicken eggs because that has not been the claim.
    Actually there is a need.
    The claim is that dogs CAN suffer from consuming raw meat incl fish and from consuming raw chicken eggs and that is why a majority of vets would not recommend raw meat/fish and chicken eggs to be given to dogs.
    Dogs (and people) CAN suffer from consuming ANYTHING, as the article linked below points out.

    I especially enjoyed the statement: (Consider the fact that many dogs use the kitty litter box as a snack tray without ill effects. Does anyone really want to argue that cat feces are free of pathogens?) Risk, raw feeding, and pathogens: a review
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    Of course many dog owners take risks with their dogs from food poisoning in presenting their dogs with raw red and white meats and raw fish and these owners are often the first to criticise process dog food companies who have to have some batches of their products recalled because of contamination etc.
    Nope, you're wrong there. I've NEVER criticized any dog food company on their recalls. Things happen, I understand that. I do dislike the connection with China however.

    Raw meat feeding presents a danger whilst proper and appropriate cooking of meat nullifies these dangers.
    Cooking meat does not always nullify all dangers. Cooked meats can have bacteria problems too. People get sick from eating cooked meats too, not just undercooked or raw ones.

    Giving dogs raw chicken eggs also presents risks of salmonella and the whites of any raw egg can deplete a dog of biotin which is essential for a dog's growth, strength and coat health.
    An old wives tale. It's been found to not be true.
    Feeding Your Dog Raw Eggs – Good Or Bad?
    Can Dogs Eat Raw Eggs? - Yahoo! Answers

    Think about it, foxes raid chicken houses, nests, etc. and eat raw eggs all the time, and they do fine. Same with other wild dogs. I have given my dogs raw eggs, on my vet's advice, egg shell and all, and again, no bad effects at all!!

    Now if you were to feed ONLY the white and frequently there could be problems, but who would not feed the yolk too?

    Once again, a dog's digestive tract is shorter than a human's. So dogs can eat things that would make us sick and be fine. In this case, things like salmonella go through the digestive tract and out the other end before it has time to incubate and make the dog sick.

    Peggy
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    You know maybe all this arguing about things over and over is a good thing. Michael posts his opinions and then we post ours, often with links to support our facts. And since all these opinions are in nearly every thread, the new people will have the opinions of several members that agree and links to support that.

    Thanks Michael for that opportunity!

    Peggy
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