Does anyone no anything about this Corgi

[Emmye]

What are the right reason to breed for.

Some one said once to Improve on the breed...

Don't you think that if some one purchased two dogs both with ch in their lines and wants to breed them that that would be there goal..He does show them -well he has a handler and her future hubby is on the road to great things too..

I really do not no what to say-- I hear what you guys say, what he says, what other say about him, Emmye, and I am very confused as what to really do... I have till July to figure it out...

Thank you please do not think i am not listening to anything you are saying- I am-

My head is just whirling with all this information and trying to make a choice that is best for Emmye. me, him...

PLEASE know that is not about MONEY for me or him he wants a great puppy to show and I think that would be fun to learn too..

[Chip's Mom]

Well you may want to take a few steps backward, take a deep breath and forget about this breeding business for a month or two and then reevaluate the whole thing. Once you take on the responsibility of owning a dog, in my humble opinion, a dog owner's utmost responsibility should be to their dog and his/her wellbeing should come way before a person's wants or needs especially someone who gave this dog away and is apparently holding the papers.

[Emmye]

I hear you guys, him, family, friends, the vet, I have a lot to figure out- a lot to learn... like hubby said we have till June to figure it out

If you had a female like Emmye with good blood lines and someone wanted to breed her with their male with good blood lines..
what would you want to know,

[corgimom]

Emmye,

How well do you know the original owner of Emmye? I am curious, who is going to be paying for the necessary tests that Emmye should have before she is bred, as well as her "future hubby"?

And also, which one of you two are going to take responsibility for the pups that are produced if the new buyers have health problems with them down the line? I can't remember if you ever mentioned it, but is it a "verbal agreement" between you and the original owner that you now are the owner ;I take it that you are not a co-owner of Emmye with the original owner.

[Emmye]

He said that he would be responsible for all cost from beginning to end.. When she goes in to heat in July he will have paper drew up with all the details of the deal.

He also said that I could have as many puppies as I wanted and if I wanted to sell them I could or he would buy them from me and sell them himself.. seeing how I was going to be doing all the work of taking care of Emmye and the puppies...
If I want he would put my name on the puppies paper as co-owner. But that does not seem like a big deal to me because if I do this it is a one time deal...

[Chip's Mom]

So you don't even own this dog?

[corgimom]

Yes, I am interested also, are you sort of like her "foster mom" - because if you are not her owner legally, how much say do you have in what care she will receive once she is pregnant ;since he is paying all the bills.

[glencorgi]

Originally Posted by Emmye

I do not know if he has seen him. The sire was the one he told me about...

And his excitement about the sire was because why? Okay, just got to say something here because my gut radar is setting off all kinds of flags, bells and whistles. Given the original owners' willingness to pass Emmye off to whomever and the happenstance way she found herself to you, that he continues to have so much interest, input and to a degree control over her ... just watch your back. The makings of a bad situation, if not one that can turn downright nasty with Emmye suffering and your heart broken. As long as she's intact, this threat is going to loom.

Wouldn't you be impressed if you had a female and her sire was from a good blood line like this....

As has been said by others, a whole lot of us here have that kind of background behind our dogs. Just because there might be a "big" name dog behind doesn't mean it is going to impress and it certainly doesn't mean the offspring needs to be bred. I can tell you Cal has a number of half brothers and sisters that are some of the fluffiest Pems around and that there is a relative with an autoimmune related condition. All of this is in Emmye's genetic background and can be passed on to her puppies should she have any.

Debbie

[corgimom]

Originally Posted by Emmye

He said that he would be responsible for all cost from beginning to end.. When she goes in to heat in July he will have paper drew up with all the details of the deal.

He also said that I could have as many puppies as I wanted and if I wanted to sell them I could or he would buy them from me and sell them himself.. seeing how I was going to be doing all the work of taking care of Emmye and the puppies...
If I want he would put my name on the puppies paper as co-owner. But that does not seem like a big deal to me because if I do this it is a one time deal...

But if you are not legally the owner of Emmye, do you have a say if this is only going to be a "one time deal". What if he wants to breed her again? I guess I don't understand the legalities here in regards to you having Emmye living with you and you didn't mention if you paid any money for her or signed a contract with him that she is yours.

And you don't co-own her with him, right. So he "said" he is going to pay all the bills from start to finish?; I would want that in writing; but truthfully, I wouldn't breed her or let her anywhere near the original owner if I had a say in it.

[Chip's Mom]

Let's play devils advocate - if Emmae has to have a c section which is highly likely and loses all of the puppies, is he still willing to pay the vet bills even though no puppies. Also, how old is Emmae and how much does she weigh? I can't remember

[Emmye]

Emmye will be 2 in April and weights 26 lbs...

Like I said I have a lot to think about.. he says that it will all be in righting and those are some of the question i have writen down to ask..

Donna

[Chip's Mom]

Donna:

Do you legally own Emmye??????

[corgimom]

Emmye,

I can't remember if you mentioned this before, but has the orginal owner bred Corgis before and if so, how long has he been doing it?

[Bayoucorgi]

It IS a good thing that Emmye has a Ch. Dad instead of a backyard dad. It gives you a better CHANCE that she might be a good quality dog. I liked that his ad said "at stud to approved bitches only" which means we HOPE he isn't used on every girl that shows up with a check in her mouth.

He had clearances. That is good. But we need to find out WHO her mom is. And what her clearances were. Remember MOM gives at least half the genes in this party. And when Emmye comes of age, she MUST have all her own clearances. It DOES NOT pass on completely - witness my Ch. OFA Excellent hips girl bred to a OFA Good male had a litter of ALL dysplastic puppies.

No, it doesn't impress me that you have this Ch. sired girl. I have had dogs who had 29 of 30 dogs in a 5-generation pedigree that were Champions. What impressed me was that I had had my hands on more than half the dogs in those 5 generations and many siblings and I knew what was good and bad about every individual in that pedigree. NOT WHAT WAS ON THE PAPER.

I would definitely contact the Dad's owner. Ask about him, tell him/her about Emmye. If they live close by, meet them. If they are a good stud dog owner they will remember Emmye's litter. They might eval her for you. I know I was always thrilled to meet my dog's kids. It gave me feedback on my "program", what I was producing, what I liked and didn't. That person can tell you about his other litters, and give you a good start on learning Emmye's background.

IT DOES NOT MATTER WHAT HE WON. The questions you should have been asking us is, Does anyone know this dog? What do you like about him, what don't you like about him? What does he produce? Does he produce sound, correct, good-temperament puppies?

Someday, you might be able to look at Emmye and say, this is a nice, cleared girl who has a good coat, correct structure, a fair topline (or whatever fault she has) and I'm going to breed her to a cleared, correct male with a superb topline that passes those on. When YOU know enough about structure and temperament and ability (I still think ability is important - any dog should be able to get an instinct test or a CD to show it is trainable) THEN you can be thinking of a boyfriend for Em.

Meanwhile, WHY all this mystery about pedigrees and papers? What is her breeders problem? Is he so disorganized that he doesn't know what litter she's from or did he not do the paperwork? This is VERY unprofessional. Keeps him OFF my "good breeder" list.

I am thrilled that you are still on the forum, still asking questions, and wanting to do the right thing. I am adopting you as my surrogate puppy owner. And I'm going to mentor you whether you like it or not!

[Bayoucorgi]

Okay, I went out and read more stuff on the second page before I sent my previous reply.

The impression I get of this breeder NOT someone you want to be associated with. A shelter or rescue would have taken more care of placing Emmye with a contractual agreement, spay/neuter agreement, health guarantee, than this "breeder" guy. Do not listen to his advice.

He got, bought, or somehow attained Emmye, passed her on to you with no interview, papers, pedigree or prelim Hip X-rays. She could definitely have a Opthalmic exam at this age and a fluffy factor test. So he has NO indication that she is PHYSICALLY sound enough to breed, but has all these plans to breed her. And he's selling her attributes on the sire's name which SHOWS that he doesn't REALLY know anything.

What clearances, background, attributes does the intended boyfriend have?

You better get a WRITTEN ownership/co-ownership contract. Think about it - you said he was once in dobes. Why is he out of dobes? Because he probably got drummed out for shady business dealings. Get clear title of Emmye or give her back. DO NOT get caught up in this puppies for dollars scheme. PLEASE don't say this isn't about MONEY. You aren't giving the puppies away, you are going to sell them. This breeding cannot 'improve the breed' when you didn't even know what this breed was a couple of months ago and it's directed by someone who has some champions in the background of his dogs and doesn't get clearances.

AND then, what about PLACING the planned puppies? What are your contracts? What are your guarantees? What is your return policy? If your future puppy owner has housing or marital issues or a child becomes allergic or they lose their job or have to move to Guam (actual rescue reasons) - will you protect the LIFE YOU CREATED FOR PROFIT and make sure that dog is safe for it's entire lifetime and placed again in an interviewed home with a fenced yard and a history of responsible pet ownership? Or will you just produce your one-time thing and go merrily along letting the selfless heros that work in Corgi rescue clean up the mess?

Sorry to talk to you so sternly, but this is the way I would talk to one of my puppy owners who came to me with a story like this just asking to create heartache and heartbreak for themselves and others.