Looking for a puppy recommendation

[Patman]

Thanks for all the responses. There has been some very interesting and valuable comments made and I agree with a lot that has been said on both sides. I think that I probably will check out Carrie's Corgis the next time I'm in the area to get a better idea of how she does things. While it does appear that she probably is not living up to what the PWCCA expects of its breeders, she does have some cute puppies and a first-hand look will certainly clarify some things for me. I am still looking for a puppy, an "almost" puppy, or possibly and older rescue, but since I'm not in a hurry I'm sure the right situation will pop up sooner or later. If you know of and Corgis (Pembroke or Cardigan) that need a good home or a good breeder with some puppies, please let me know.

Patman

[Peggy]

Originally Posted by Chip's Mom

If nobody bought from byb's, what would happen to the puppies? Are there enough rescue groups available to take them all in? Is there enough "hobby" breeders to fill the demand for corgi puppies and what would the price be then?

No there aren't enough hobby breeders to fill the wants of people who will buy puppies. And some of those people are people that hobby breeders will not place puppies with. For this reason there will always be a "need" for byb's and puppy mills. They will sell to those who buy puppies on impulse or who most of us would not consider responisble owners.

Isn't that a little like what the animal rights people are trying to do - tell a person what they can and cannot do with their dog. They are just going way to the extreme and want all of the them spayed or neutered, some just want the right to breed to be given to a select few.

Not exactly. I don't want the right given to a select few. Yes, I disagree with byb's but I will defend their "right" to breed their dogs. I disagree with how they're doing it and how they're placing thier puppies. I have the right to disagree and I have the right to tell people I would not recommend buying from them.

I have a different outlook on this then most people, I do believe that people that don't show their dogs can still have healthy puppies that meet the standard.

Not really, I have that feeling too. There are those who don't show that can breed correctly but they are very few and far between. There are some who will breed and will do the health tests and will screen buyers. But as a rule most byb's don't. And puppy mills sure do not.

Sure some puppies have flaws but so do some puppies that are bred by the hobby breeders.

If you want to get real technical ALL dogs have flaws/faults. None of us have yet to breed the perfect dog. It's not going to happen since Mother Nature makes sure of that. However, it's the trying that is important, trying to breed to the standard, trying to breed that perfect or ideal dog.

When you buy a puppy it is a gamble and this lady is giving you a two year warranty so to speak.

A warrenty for what? I didn't read it. Usually though it means you have to return the puppy. They're banking on you won't want to return a dog you've have for two years and then you find out is dysplastic.

Reputable breeders will also take back a puppy if it should get hip dysplasia or some genetic disease. And that is for the LIFE of the dog not just two years.

And many/most reputable breeders will be willing to work with the home if they don't want to return the dog.

However, IMO, no one should "guarantee" something genetic. Breeders, reputable or not are not Gods. We can do the x rays, health tests, but we cannot guarantee that a dog will not get hip dysplasia. You can breed two OFA excellent dogs and still get dysplasctic puppies. However, the health tests lessen the chances and that is what we are going for.

And IMO, owners should not ask for guarantees for things like hip dysplasia. They should ask to see the OFA certificates but not expect perfection. Just that the breeder is doing their best.

JMO.
Peggy

[Chip's Mom]

First of all thank you both for concessions. In a perfect world, everyone would breed responsibly and all animals would have a forever home and be well taken care of. Unfortunately, life isn't perfect and there will always be people that don't do what they should because of ignorance or greed or both. I do believe and will continue to believe that there are alot of byb's (not my term) that raise healthy beautiful pups and geniunely care about their animals and take care of them properly. It is up to us the buyer to check out the breeders, go to their home, ask for references, talk to owners who acquired their pups from the breeder, etc. I will go one step further and say that is why I don't particularly believe in mail order puppies where they are shipped, sight unseen to a home. People on both sides can lie or fool people into believing they have a perfect home for a pup or that they are a perfect breeder but people fool people everyday. I do not like stereotypes. I think it is unfair to people all ways around as there is good and bad in all.

I have never been involved in rescue but I have picked starving pups up from the garbage dump, the side of the road, etc, brought them home, got them healthy and found homes for them. I have taken dogs that people didn't want and rehomed them. I currently have 1 rottie mix that is 11 years old that I got from the shelter when she was six weeks old and came down with full blown parvo 3 days later. I took her directly from the shelter to the vets and had already started her on puppy shots. When I called the shelter to let them know that parvo was in their midst, she just said bring her back and pick up another puppy. $500 later, many vet visits, I had a healthy dog. I also have Lady who was unwanted and I took her in when she was a year old. She had been mistreated by a 3 year old to the point that her ears are permanently damaged. She had pups one hour after I brought her home. I sold her pups and got her spayed and shots that she had never had. She is now about 15. I have another dog that we found in the field with two other puppies half starved and we brought them home, fed them and found homes for the other two. We kept the one because the Vet said she would not adapt to another home because of the trauma she had gone through and her nature. My lil Digger died 3 months before his 15th birthday and we found him weighing 1 1/2 lbs, ate up by fleas and full of worms running down the middle of a road and he was about 6 weeks old. My daughter just found homes for two min pins that weren't wanted by their owners. My son also stopped on a four lane highway to retrieve a chihuahua that was running down the road. He went door to door and found the owner. An elderly man that was very happy to have his little companion back. My oldest daughter recently got a chow mix from a rescue group and he had lice, coxcitia (sp) and parvo. She spent alot of money but he is also a healthy puppy. I tell you all this so you will know that I do know about animals suffering and I do know a little about rescue even though I have never been involved in one. Now I will get off my soapbox.

[Michael Romanos]

There is not a thing wrong with casual, hobby, recreational, and not-for-profit dog breeders. What is wrong is any poor care and attention of breeders towards the parents and the pups and in any real (not just perceived) poor selection of pediigree dogs for breeding.

[Vannette]

Bonnie, I am so glad to hear of soft hearted people like you. You know that special spot? You got it.
Thank you