1st time at Stud

[hottpixie5]

Well, if all goes as planned, my little Odie is gonna stud for the first time in about a week. I was contacted by a guy that lives in my area who owns a mother-daughter pair. Really pretty girls. He wants my Odie to get together will his younger girl (she'll be 2 in august, he'll be 2 in september), and it will be her first litter too. We're pretty excited and I think they'd make some really cute puppies. We've been thinking about getting a female puppy of our own, to have a pair. So it'll be good to see what he's made of.

Pictures attached. Odie has less white on his face, the female has more white.

[glencorgi]

Is the small picture the female he's going to be bred to? If so, she is a mismark in Pembrokes.

Debbie

[MyPemCharlie]

Yes, she does have too much white. The guy shouldn't be trying to breed her.

[Michael Romanos]

If the daughter is mismarked, it could have evolved through her mother. So that might also be a bad choice. Your Odie looks like a lovely example of a Pem. He deserves a better selection. Keep looking. There are owners of pure bred dogs (including Corgis) who advertise in various publications in New Zealand offering their male dogs for stud duties. However the choice is yours and that of the owner of the females. If you want to do the best for the breed, skip this, as tempting and as convenient as it may seem.

[fogebotom]

Also, before you make any decisions-has the owner of the females provided health testing certificates to you? OFA, PennHip, CERF, current brucellois, VwD? I would be concerned that if any of the offspring have issues, he would be more then apt to blame the stud dog, and since you have your stud dog all tested(which you do, don't you?), the ball is left in his court.

Too much white is indeed a mismark and with my experiences with producing a couple cardigan mismark puppies, I agree with everyone else, should not be bred as there's a very strong chance that puppies produced would be mismarks. The goal in breeding is to breed as close to the standard and health dogs, isn't it? Have you compared the pedigrees to make sure that they are compatible? Or looked at the females to see if there are any lines that you know of that would harbor health or temperment issues?

Your boy deserves the best, not just what is around the corner.

[MyPemCharlie]

Don't the dogs have to be 2 years old for CERF & OFA, or am I thinking of something elase? I figured you were planning to test in the fall when both dogs are "of age" and then decide. That gives you plenty of time to find a better "mate" without mismarks who may already have her health certifications.

[glencorgi]

Two years for OFA, CERF can be done beginning as puppies and should be updated annually.

Debbie

[fogebotom]

OFA can be done before two but it's called a prelim and is not official. Only one person evaluates the xrays rather then the panel that does them after the dog is two. Not near as reliable.

PennHip can be done at any time after the dog is 4 mos old.

CERF can be done at any time-I have puppies as young as 6 weeks done BUT it is only good for year and then to be kept current must be done every year by a board certified opthomologist.

Brucellosis should be done no more then 30 days before a breeding occurs and must or should be done every time a dog is bred. Simple blood test. It's an STD-in it's simplest terms. With the rise in cases of mycoplasma - that's another one that should be tested for--that one is almost as nasty as brucellosis.

The biggest red flag for anyone is to say my vet looked at my dog and says he's #1 a good representative of the breed and #2 looks healthy enough to breed. Unless your vet is a breeder of your breed and is well versed and knowledgeable in structure, health and temperment of your breed-they wouldn't know a good breed representative if it bit them. Healthy, yes they could say that but honestly, only if they are a certififed orthopedic surgeon, opthomologist or reproductive specialist, there is no basis for their comments.

[hottpixie5]

how is she "mismarked" i've always found the explainations i've read online to be a little fuzzy and accompanied by pictures of severely mismarked dogs (ie: white on backs, white head, etc)....thanks

[Peggy]

Originally Posted by hottpixie5

how is she "mismarked" i've always found the explainations i've read online to be a little fuzzy and accompanied by pictures of severely mismarked dogs (ie: white on backs, white head, etc)....thanks

White should not go past the shoulders or above the elbows. White on the face should be "narrow blaze". White should not touch the eyes. We do allow for a little more there, but she appears to have too much white on her face (looks to touch her eye rims), and possibly too much on her back, going past her shoulders.

Too much white can result in a "whitely" puppy which can be deaf. There is a reason we don't want corgis with too much white bred.

Besides the white it's the health tests you should be asking about. Your boy should have them and any female he's bred to should have them.

And IMO, anyone who breeds should have a goal in mind. They need to know the assets and faults on each of the dogs according to the standard. You don't want to be breeding two dogs with the same faults.

The best way to learn this is to show your dog. If you don't show then chances are you do not know how to apply the standard to your dog. Or how to recognize the faults and how your dog compares to others.

Does the owner show his dog? Have the health tests been done? What about your boy? Your responsibility to any puppies is to try to create puppies as healthy as possible and as close to the standard as possible.

Peggy