Inbreeding - good or bad?

[corgimom]

deleted.....

[darci]

I dont have any experience with inbreeding, but I would be afraid of health problems that might not be apparent yet.

Hopefully some other members with breeding experience will be able to better answer your questions.

[darci]

www.canine-genetics.com/Price.htm

Heres a link to a website I found, maybe it will help anwser some of your questions.

[corgimom]

Thanks Cindy, I will read it

[glencorgi]

I began answering this in the other thread, discovered I might have a mutiny if I didn't go buy food for the wee beasties' dinner tonight and had to delay my response.

The short answer to "inbreeding - good or bad?" is - it can be both. But those are the same risks as with any other form of breeding.

There are 4 types of breeding - inbreeding, line-breeding, outcrossing. Each are tools (or can be tools) within a breeding program and there are/ can be times and places for each of them. The 4th type is outbreeding and rarely has a place in any true breeding program.

Inbreeding is the breeding of two closely related relatives; father to daughter, mother to son, brother to sister, half-brother to half-sister. What a responsible breeder using this as a tool in their breeding program would be hoping to do is to "set" a trait - such as a correct front and double up on positive points about a dog. The down side is one is also doubling up on negative traits as well.

Line-breeding is the breeding of a slightly removed relative - say a grandsire to a granddaughter, a nephew to an aunt, or dogs with many common relatives in their background. This method can reinforce positive characteristics, can be useful in eliminating health problems and one gets a consistency in uniform quality.

Outcrossing is when one breeds two dogs of different linebred backgrounds. This can introduce new desirable traits and characteristics; the down side is that you can also introduce negatives one didn't have before as well. First generation offspring often lacks consistency across the board.

Outbreeding is more the random breeding of two unrelated dogs. Common scenario for this is one neighbor breeds her dog to another neighbor's pet shop bought puppy. They're the same breed but that's about it.

All breeders of any species - horses, cats, mice, cattle, goats, etc. employ these tools in their programs.
Some websites to dig a little deeper:
http://showcase.netins.net/web/royal...ing-types.html
http://carawatha.tripod.com/inbreeding.htm
http://www.rhiannon-cavaliers.com/linebreeding.htm
http://www.thedogscene.co.uk/article...nebreeding.htm
http://www.myotonicmeatgoats.com/Linebreeding.htm
Ton of stuff out there.

Have I been involved in such a close breeding? Yes, and we got a very nice litter - a couple of outstanding Cardigans which gained their championships and some performance titles in the litter as well, some fluffies (which we were aware could happen knowing the background of the parents), but happily no overbites, which was another thing we knew could potentially occur from this breeding. The puppies are now all around 7 years of age, still healthy, happy and being the love of their owners' lives.

Would *I* consider buying a puppy from an in-bred breeding such as Corgimom has described? Yes, I would - but in my case I might be looking at the breeding from a different perspective than a lot of other puppy buyers here might. My perspective would be one of a conformation and performance niche in addition to being my pal. The majority of the forums members here likely would have those roles reversed - family companion and pet first and then maybe other activities.

What would be more of a concern to me with this particular breeding is the breeder. That there isn't a contract is a bother. Are the puppies being sold on limited registration and will need to be spayed or neutered? That the dam has had her health testing is good, not so good about the sire of the litter.

Your friend could ask why she decided to do this particular breeding. Ask why the sire was not tested for hips and eyes. She can even ask about a contract. Send her the link from Emrys Corgis that is in the other thread about what to look for in a breeder. IF the breeder isn't going to "interview" your friend, then let your friend use that website to interview the breeder - perfectly acceptable. I know I'm delighted when questions come up that I may not thought about asking or on things I'd forgotten to explain. Shows someone has done their homework.

Hope this helps!
Debbie

[darci]

Wow.....

Great information, I had no idea.....
Good post and easy to understand.


I learn so many new things every day, I am loving having forums to come to for questions and answers. It's wonderful to have so many other people out there willing to share their experience's and wisdom.

[darci]

Darci wants to help too......

[darci]

There are so many different opinions out there on breeding and inbreeding.

What are some of the major health issue's that can happen, besides the overbite and flufflies that you mentioned?

[KatC]

I owned a German Shepherd Dog who was the result of a Brother/Sister mating. This was not deliberate but an unfortunate incident for the Breeders who had all Champion Show Dogs. They made sure we knew and understood the history, and the condition of sale was limited register and spaying.

The Good was - An exceedingly handsome dog who had inherited exceptional build and looks.

The Very Bad was - She had a highly nervous temperament and was quite timid to the point of losing control of her bowels in certain situations. The Vet said this excessive nervousness was most likely due to the inbreeding. I do not know if this is correct.

Otherwise she was fine, but we were always watchful of her with other people and warn them not to tease her as a nervous GSD is not a good thing, and if cornered or feel they are being threatened will react violently due to fear.

[Michael Romanos]

Inbreeding is best avoided.

[glencorgi]

Originally Posted by darci

What are some of the major health issue's that can happen, besides the overbite and flufflies that you mentioned?

It depends upon the breed quite a bit and the mode of inheritance. We can look at KatC's example of the temperament of her GSD. Temperament is very much an inherited trait. The line of the grandsire or granddam of her dog may have been prone to a more nervous type temperament. Once it was doubled up on in the brother sister mating, then it was "set" in the puppy/her dog. Environment can only go so far in overcoming an "iffy" type temperament and in someone else's home KatC's dog might have become a fear biter and even euthanized due to the nervousness of her temperament.

PRA, which is an eye problem in Cardigans, has an autosomal recessive mode of inheritance - which means both parents have to carry a gene for it. Parents eyes will be fine, but IF one breeds a carrier to a carrier then there is the risk of puppies that will go blind.

Really though, I can't think of a serious health issue that can come out of an inbreeding that could not occur in any of the other types of breedings. Now if a breeder has a specific health problem in their line and continues to breed closely, inbreeding or even close linebreedings, then they are only going to continue to perpetuate the problem. That is why it is so important to know one's dogs, what is behind them and be honest about them, in order to make responsible decisions as to when to implement which of the breeding
methods.



Debbie

[corgimom]

Debbie,

Thanks for all the info, I will pass it on to her. She did say it was required to
spay or neuter them, but this would only be indicated on the registration forms and that there was no contract. - I find the "no contract" thing not a
good thing; however, she can make her own decision what she wants to do.
Thanks again for all the information. I have heard about dogs that are inbred
maybe being more hyper than usual.

linda

[glencorgi]

>I have heard about dogs that are inbred maybe being more hyper than >usual.

Linda,

A lot of that will depend upon the temperament of the parents.

Debbie