Chewing on paws...

[Michael Romanos]

Relatively few dogs suffer from food allergies. Relatively few humans suffer from food allergies. My food allergy is some types of shellfish which is a shame because New Zealand is shellfish loaded.

[PickettinVirginia]

Poor Einstein. My Pem Pickett is 11yo, and has been chewing his front right paw for years, on and off, maybe 6 years. We've tried changing food of course from reg. Purina, to a lamb and rice, to duck, and back again. We switched him from commercial chewies (Alpo brand if I remember) to pigs' ears which are calorie-laden but very low allergen. We really didn't notice any change as we expected. Once our vet put him on Pred, which suppresses the body's immune response, and we ended up with a flourish of Demodexic mange, due to compromised immune. So now, he can't have Pred bec of extreme reaction, so I hope nothing serious crops up. We've tried various shampoos, some with lavender, oatmeal, other calming and soothing agents; some au naturel, some prescription. Nothing has really been convincing as a good remedy.

Pick is now on California Natural, dried chicken breast as a chewie (which isn't really very chewy), CN's Gentle Snackers as his cookie (before bed and special treats).

Really and truly, we think Pickett's chewing his foot is his thumb-sucking, his pacifier. We've kept diaries to track his behavior and response, and can't see a correlation anywhere.

So, you did mention a jute rug; sounds possible that there's something there. It would be worth removing it totally, as in to the garage, wrapped in heavy plastic, and a thorough cleaning. Change everything you can -- bedding, towels, sanitize his food bowls, throw out old chew toys and start new. First thing to do is eliminate all, and gradually add back in, with some time in between and wait for a reaction.

One noticeable event: he would dive for his feet (foot) even when I dried them carefully. Since we've been building a house, I know there's tons of "new and foreign" stuff out there. On a recent day, I was barefoot outside, planting pansies, and came in from digging in the dirt, and dove for MY feet. And I had small red bumps that still itch a week later. So I know there's something real biting him now. But his chewing as gone on for too long before this. Good luck! sue on va's chesapeake bay

Originally Posted by dragonfly37

My Pem Corgi Einstein has been nipping and chewing on his paws for over 6 months now. He's already once scratched the fur off the back of both front legs. Now he's graduated to nipping at his back paws and I can see pink irritated skin through his fur. We took him to the vet and they ran some blood and allergy tests and came up with lamb, chicken,some grasses and possibly seasonal allergies. We had him at the vet for two weeks and when we brought him home the first 2-3 days he did not itch or nip at all and then started up with the nipping/itching again. While he was at the vet he ate the food he normally eats at home. SO my conclusion is it's either the weaved jute rug he plays on and/or dust. I'm going to start vacumming more frequently for the next month to see what happens and then put the rug downstairs to see if that works. If those two are not the culprit I don't know what else to do.


Anyone else here have Corgis with allergies? What are the symptoms/behaviours? How did you fix the problem? I feel so bad for our lil dude. : (


Thanks so much!

-
Stacy

[PickettinVirginia]

Great response for dragonfly. One aspect of the raw diet, which we haven't done, but are considering if Pickett's itchy foot doesn't abate, is the source of the raw food. A friend feeds raw, but when I asked her where she got her chicken, she said "wherever's cheap, mostly Wal-Mart." Now, thinking about that, cheap chicken, whatever the store, is never top grade, and purchased by (W-M) at the rock-bottom-est price. Guaranteed, it's never grown cheaply with your child's or corgi's health in mind; only for maximum profit.

If you don't know where the chicken came from (meaning, who's the grower? not the seller), then what have you done? Nothing. The whole idea here, is to control aspects of your pup's environment, and that must include the way his food was grown. Something to think about.

sue on Virginia's chesapeake bay

[Michael Romanos]

One should always cook raw meat before giving it to a dog, especially so meat from chickens, game, offal, wild animals. The only risk that should be taken is with the odd raw beef or lamb bone of certain types because the benefits are worthwhile.

[Peggy]

Originally Posted by Michael Romanos

One should always cook raw meat before giving it to a dog, especially so meat from chickens, game, offal, wild animals. The only risk that should be taken is with the odd raw beef or lamb bone of certain types because the benefits are worthwhile.

Michael there is a raw diet now that many people are using. And their dogs are doing fine. I have given my dogs raw turkey necks (great for keeping teeth clean) and the occasional chicken part. Yes, raw. Bones and all. And I have used the Nature's Variety Prairie frozen food. It helped get a sick dog through a rough time when he wouldn't eat anything else.

Again, there is more than one way to feed a dog, and there are those that are wiling to take the time and effort to learn about the raw diet. I say more power to them. I don't do a whole raw diet but do like to give turkey necks at times.

Again, more than one right way to feed a dog.

Peggy

[Michael Romanos]

Sorry Peggy, but you're incorrect to think that feeding dogs raw meat is a good alternative to other diets. Raw meat is quite simply very risky business and is therefore not recommended by most vets and canine nutritionists. Raw chicken are other game such as venison, turkey, duck etc, wild animals such as possums, kangaroos etc, and offal are particularly risky. Would most dog owners wish to take risks when risk-free alternatives are there for the taking. Beef steaks and lamb steaks or the meat from lamb chops are the least risky if given raw to a dog but there is still the risk element and the cooking of these meats and the other meats mentioned are not such a lot inferior in food value for a dog that makes a decision to feed raw imperative.

[glencorgi]

Originally Posted by Michael Romanos

Raw meat is quite simply very risky business and is therefore not recommended by most vets and canine nutritionists.

The raw diet niche in the US is one of the fastest growing in terms of new foods and pre-packaged products hitting the market. Vets are not likely to recommend it (most of them don't understand it having received the bulk of their nutritional education from Hills), but just about to a one of owners who seek out the assistance of a canine nutritionist are recommended to go to a raw diet. Even AAFCO has given what Michael refers to as its seal of approval to many of them. From a bag of Nature's Variety Prairie Beef Diet (Raw Frozen Diet for Dogs and Cats): Nature's Variety Prairie Brand Beef Raw Frozen Diet is formulated to meet the nutritional levels established by the AAFCO Dog and Cat Food Nutrient Profiles for All Life Stages. Same "approval" appears on the Chicken and Lamb varieties.

Sort of an interesting irony is when I first joined Go Corgi, Michael himself was feeding what could be described as a modified raw diet and poo-pooing those who fed kibble. How things have changed.

Dr. Billinghurst has been around a long, long time and many have raised healthy, long lived dogs on his diet recommendations. Today's raw feeding options have come a long way from his early works. With today's prepackaged options, one can just easily feed a raw diet and they can pour out a cup of kibble.

Debbie

[Michael Romanos]

Debbie blames the world's ills on Hills. Must take the pressure off Mr Bush.
I don't think independent canine nutritionists and independent vets in the western world are unduly influenced by Hills who while are a world leader in canine nutrition and in producing outstanding food for dogs, are just one of at least a dozen who produce super premium, AAFCO-approved dog food.

AAFCO approve of the minimum standards of food that provide for a dog's requirements of vitamins, minerals and nutriants to form a complete and balanced diet, not the contents per se.

Imcidently, feeding raw offal to dogs in New Zealand is against the law of the land and has been that way for 50 years or so.

[glencorgi]

Originally Posted by Michael Romanos

Debbie blames the world's ills on Hills. Must take the pressure off Mr Bush.

I'm not blaming anything on Hills, just stating a fact about veterinary nutritional courses or lack of them in the US. It is always entertaining to read your witty come backs, can't say anything knowledgeable take a pot shot at an easy target.

AAFCO approve of the minimum standards of food that provide for a dog's requirements of vitamins, minerals and nutriants to form a complete and balanced diet, not the contents per se.

It is such a relief you have finally grasp that concept.

I don't think independent canine nutritionists and independent vets in the western world are unduly influenced by Hills

Nutritionists are not as likely to be influenced in any way by Hills. Vet's, well you should visit their waiting rooms and see the foods they offer for sale to clients.

Now let's apply the concept you've finally grasped about what AAFCO actually is and does to your comment below:

who while are a world leader in canine nutrition and in producing outstanding food for dogs, are just one of at least a dozen who produce super premium, AAFCO-approved dog food.

Bringing back an analogy I used previously; one can meet the minimum required nutritional recommendations set forth by the USDA for humans by eating at McDonald's 3 times a day, IF one chooses from the menu wisely. Is this a quality diet? Not really, but the minimal nutritional requirements are being met. The same can be of many what are considered premium dog foods. The offal which is illegal to feed to dogs raw, can be cooked/rendered and put into foods can it not?

Debbie

[Michael Romanos]

A lot of offal that is cooked is excellent for dogs and some are considered The Best, eg tripe, ox hearts.

Feeding raw meat to dogs can result in the following:
Samonella - can produce gastroenteritis outbreaks in dogs.
E.coli - can cause illness in dogs.
Campylobacter - can cause enteric infection to humans in being transmitted from dogs.
Yersinia enterocolitica - can be transmitted from dogs to humans.
Listeric monocytogenes - can cause abortion in dogs.
Clostridium perfringens - can cause enteritis in dogs.
Staphyloclccus aureus - can produce toxin in dogs.
Clostridium botulinum - is toxic to dogs.
Bacillus cereus - can produce toxin in dogs.
Bacillus anthracis - can produce toxin in dogs.

too much red meat - possible cause of cancers in dogs.

This list is not a good advert for feeding raw meat to dogs - and this list was NOT produced by Hills Science.

[Freppan]

Does EVERY thread have to turn into a feeding debate?

We each feed differently and can suggest whatever we want to whomever we want. End of story.

[Vannette]

Michael...you need to do real research on rawfeeding before you start bad mouthing it the way you do. If you just put in "rawfeeding for dogs" in your search bar there is some good information out there. We that feed raw have done our research.

[glencorgi]

Originally Posted by Vannette

Michael...you need to do real research on rawfeeding before you start bad mouthing it the way you do.

Vanette, I am shocked I tell you, simply shocked! Are you saying Michael might not be the ultimate source of knowledge on this topic? My bubble is burst.

Debbie

[fogebotom]

As a person who worked with a gentleman with a Phd in animal nutrition and who took almost all the course work offered to vets in this country, he will tell you that vets for the most part are not required to take extensive nutrition classes and that most of the classes are underwritten by Hills or a simlar dog food company. Also, they usually are only required to take one to two classes in order to graduate. Most do just the minimum.

So with that being said, his comment about kibble and allergies: dog kibble is the most researched food out there-more so then human food. You or I could live on it. But quality of the ingredients leaves a lot to be desired. Allergies can happen and just as the human maldies are increasing so will the allergies in our dogs.

His comments on raw-as long as a person uses high quality ingredients, knows where it came from and takes their dogs in for reqular vet phyiscals including blood work up, parasite prevention, etc. There is nothing wrong with it.

I had a dog awhile back that was carbo challenged. Similar to a hyperactive child. Changed her to a high protein, low carb modified raw diet. She was much easier to live with.

My first post talked about outside environment factors-detergents, cleaners and such. Once those are ruled out, then I would look at food but under no terms should you be doing all this change at once, it could do serious harm to your dog and you'll be up to your armpits in more medical issues.

Just as people in the same family can not always eat the same food, our animals are the same way. I have four different diets in my house-few dogs on Pro Plan with one of those highly allergic to barley. Diamond adult for a few more, that's the only thing my GSD will keep down. Eagle Holistic for Eddie along with Nature's Variety Frozen Raw Chicken diet and last but not least Pro Plan small breed puppy for my toy dogs.

Each dog gets what they need to stay healthy.

[Michael Romanos]

I think each dog gets what WE give them.

In New Zealand, the vets and the vet nurses/assistants must go through canine and cat nutition courses as part of their study and examinations towards a veterinaty degree etc. The courses and study are not arranged by any dog food manufacturing company.