Dental Problem: Base Narrow Canines

[MyPemCharlie]

As many of you have read, Charlie went to the vet Monday to have his two lower retained baby canine teeth surgically pulled. The adult teeth had erupted "base narrow", essentially inside the baby teeth and under his tongue. Initially the vet had said not to worry about any retained teeth until he was 7 months old when they would want to pull any "hangers on". Because the adult teeth were starting to get quite large (and the babies weren't loose), I had the baby teeth pulled. The vet said that they should have pulled them at least a week or two earlier. So much for "don't worry".

The result of waiting too long to have retained teeth pulled, is that the adult teeth may not move into the proper position and end up growing into the roof of Charlie's mouth (creating a huge mess with his sinuses, not to mention making it difficult to eat). They call the dental misalignment a malocclusion. I call it a potentially huge headache. If the teeth don't move, the options are to have the teeth filed down, root canal and capped; have an orthodontist make an incline plane (orthodontic plate); or have the adult teeth pulled.

There is some hope. Since I didn't take the vets initial advice to wait 7 months, Charlie's teeth still have some chance of moving. With a little help. I've done some reading and may be able to help his teeth move with a little rubber ball. The technique is to find a hard rubber round or oval "toy" which is only slightly larger than the distance between the narrowly-set teeth. That is about 3/4" in Charlie's case. Then get the dog to chew on it for at least 15 minutes, 3 times a day. The ball is suppose to apply enough outward pressure on the canines to slowly move them into position. Supposedly there is about a 75% success rate in dogs under 7 months old.

Great. Sounds good in theory right? How about practice? I took Charlie to the pet store yesterday. Do you think we could find a 3/4" ball (about the size of my thumb print)? We even looked a parrot and ferret toys. The smallest balls I could find were some 1" cat toys in a bag of 6. We also bought a puppy Kong, the small end is slightly over and inch. Anyway, we picked up about $30 in balls and toys which had small round ends. None of them are as small as recommended for success. OK, so how to get your dog to chew for 15 minutes, with his canine teeth (not his molars), and not swallow the ball??? Especially when you've taught bite inhibition, and now you have a tiny ball between your fingers, saying "bite down". LOL

All I could think to do is tie several of the cat toy balls into a sock with several knots and play some tug of war (which I'm not sure is accomplishing the goal). I've been dipping the other toys into watered-down "thin" peanut butter trying to get him to bite with his front teeth while I hold the other end of the toy.

Does anyone have any better ideas on how to implement this "treatment"? Also, anything you can think of that is hard rubber and 3/4"? I'm still inclined to tie anything that small into a sock or fabric, as I'm pretty sure he would swallow it otherwise.

[Corgis4me]

I wish you good luck in finding a solution, but truthfully I would not let my dog chew on a ball that small, he may not swollow it, but choke on it and then what; I know of someone that happened to and the dog did not survive.

[glencorgi]

Oh man, what a bummer Chris. Don't know if this gives you hope or not, but bites finally settle about a year of age. Changes can occur up until that time frame. (Lots of recent discussion on this topic on Showdogs-L, an international forum for those who show - hence the name <G>).

Not sure where you'd find balls that small and one that small I'll have to admit to worrying that he could swallow it. YIKES! Did you by chance come across any of the small Kongs? Some of the puppy ones or those for Toy breeds are pretty tiny in diameter on the smaller end and might be the closest in size to what was recommended. A little stuffing and maybe a good incentive to get him to work his teeth in the recommended way.

Good luck!

Debbie

[Peggy]

Originally Posted by MyPemCharlie

As many of you have read, Charlie went to the vet Monday to have his two lower retained baby canine teeth surgically pulled. The adult teeth had erupted "base narrow", essentially inside the baby teeth and under his tongue. Initially the vet had said not to worry about any retained teeth until he was 7 months old when they would want to pull any "hangers on". Because the adult teeth were starting to get quite large (and the babies weren't loose), I had the baby teeth pulled. The vet said that they should have pulled them at least a week or two earlier. So much for "don't worry".

The result of waiting too long to have retained teeth pulled, is that the adult teeth may not move into the proper position and end up growing into the roof of Charlie's mouth (creating a huge mess with his sinuses, not to mention making it difficult to eat). They call the dental misalignment a malocclusion. I call it a potentially huge headache. If the teeth don't move, the options are to have the teeth filed down, root canal and capped; have an orthodontist make an incline plane (orthodontic plate); or have the adult teeth pulled.

There is some hope. Since I didn't take the vets initial advice to wait 7 months, Charlie's teeth still have some chance of moving. With a little help. I've done some reading and may be able to help his teeth move with a little rubber ball. The technique is to find a hard rubber round or oval "toy" which is only slightly larger than the distance between the narrowly-set teeth. That is about 3/4" in Charlie's case. Then get the dog to chew on it for at least 15 minutes, 3 times a day. The ball is suppose to apply enough outward pressure on the canines to slowly move them into position. Supposedly there is about a 75% success rate in dogs under 7 months old.

Great. Sounds good in theory right? How about practice? I took Charlie to the pet store yesterday. Do you think we could find a 3/4" ball (about the size of my thumb print)? We even looked a parrot and ferret toys. The smallest balls I could find were some 1" cat toys in a bag of 6. We also bought a puppy Kong, the small end is slightly over and inch. Anyway, we picked up about $30 in balls and toys which had small round ends. None of them are as small as recommended for success. OK, so how to get your dog to chew for 15 minutes, with his canine teeth (not his molars), and not swallow the ball??? Especially when you've taught bite inhibition, and now you have a tiny ball between your fingers, saying "bite down". LOL

All I could think to do is tie several of the cat toy balls into a sock with several knots and play some tug of war (which I'm not sure is accomplishing the goal). I've been dipping the other toys into watered-down "thin" peanut butter trying to get him to bite with his front teeth while I hold the other end of the toy.

Does anyone have any better ideas on how to implement this "treatment"? Also, anything you can think of that is hard rubber and 3/4"? I'm still inclined to tie anything that small into a sock or fabric, as I'm pretty sure he would swallow it otherwise.

You know I think I'd talk to the orthodontist, is there a chance that bands might help. I've heard of those being used on dogs. I'd see about that maybe.

And I think the kong would be a good idea. I too would be worried about him swallowing a small ball.

Peggy

[MyPemCharlie]

I did buy a puppy Kong...the smallest one the store had. He won't chew on it, even though I think the tip is still too wide for what we're trying to do. When I stuff it with treats, peanut butter, etc, he just "licks it to death".

No I'm not going to put a 3/4" item in his mouth by itself for fear of choking, swallowing, blockage. Yikes! It would have to be wrapped in a cloth/sock for my comfort level, with me hanging onto an end.

If the teeth don't move out naturally, I am planning to go the orthodontic route. I read Chip's Mom's horror story here about going the root canal/cap route, all for naught...except the lighter wallet. I also don't want to have his otherwise perfectly healthy teeth pulled, which is the cheap easy vet's route. (Pulling them is what my vet's recommended Monday if they don't move outward, until I asked if he knew any dog dentists/orthodontists locally. Apparently vets who don't do advanced dentistry/orthodontics just say, "Yank 'em". Buyer beware that there are other options.)

I just need to figure out something the right size, to get in the right place, that Charlie will bite on. It sounds so simple. In theory.

[Peggy]

Originally Posted by MyPemCharlie

I did buy a puppy Kong...the smallest one the store had. He won't chew on it, even though I think the tip is still too wide for what we're trying to do. When I stuff it with treats, peanut butter, etc, he just "licks it to death".

No I'm not going to put a 3/4" item in his mouth by itself for fear of choking, swallowing, blockage. Yikes! It would have to be wrapped in a cloth/sock for my comfort level, with me hanging onto an end.

Oh, ok, that makes more sense!

If the teeth don't move out naturally, I am planning to go the orthodontic route. I read Chip's Mom's horror story here about going the root canal/cap route, all for naught...except the lighter wallet. I also don't want to have his otherwise perfectly healthy teeth pulled, which is the cheap easy vet's route. (Pulling them is what my vet's recommended Monday if they don't move outward, until I asked if he knew any dog dentists/orthodontists locally. Apparently vets who don't do advanced dentistry/orthodontics just say, "Yank 'em". Buyer beware that there are other options.)

Well, to be honest, most of their clients probably don't want to spend the money for the orthodontics. So they just pull them. I'm with you on not wanting to pull healthy teeth. Good luck, we'll hope the chew toy works and that you find one that fits!

I just need to figure out something the right size, to get in the right place, that Charlie will bite on. It sounds so simple. In theory.

So many things sound so simple, in theory!

Peggy

[MyPemCharlie]

I wish these articles I found on the "rubber ball" thereapy (written by dog orthodontists) would have done more than explain the theory... HOW to do it is the dilemna. Kind of like giving someone an list of foods for a perfect recipe, without saying where to get the ingredients, mixing instructions or how long to bake.

[Peggy]

Originally Posted by MyPemCharlie

I wish these articles I found on the "rubber ball" thereapy (written by dog orthodontists) would have done more than explain the theory... HOW to do it is the dilemna. Kind of like giving someone an list of foods for a perfect recipe, without saying where to get the ingredients, mixing instructions or how long to bake.

Is there any contact info with them? Maybe google the names and see if they have web sites and email addesses? Maybe you could write to them and get some advice.

Peggy

[MyPemCharlie]

Well that might be worth a try. Most of the articles were from news media releases, but mainly quoting interviews with a vet, Dr Carmichael in West Islip. Through several different articles, I found different bits and pieces of information on the subject.

Here is one of several articles I found on the topic:

recordonline.com - Bucktoothed dog? A rubber ball can help

This article is a little more detailed with lots of references listed:

WSAVA 2001 - A Removable Orthodontic Appliance for Dogs

[Peggy]

Originally Posted by MyPemCharlie

Well that might be worth a try. Most of the articles were from news media releases, but mainly quoting interviews with a vet, Dr Carmichael in West Islip. Through several different articles, I found different bits and pieces of information on the subject.

Here is one of several articles I found on the topic:

recordonline.com - Bucktoothed dog? A rubber ball can help

Intresting. I think the 15 mins. 3 times a day would be the hard part. I'm not sure a dog is going to hold a rubber ball for 15 min. Well, mine wouldn't anyway. Maybe put something yummy on it?

Is there a vetrinary orthodontist near you that you can have do a consultation?

I was thinking rubber bands, I know they've been used on dogs to move teeth.

Peggy